The Madsen Machine Gun

19 The Madsen [LORDS] Gun. 2 a request for a supply of this particular type of machine-gun. But I cannot speak with any authority on that point. The present Commander-in-Chief has never ■ asked for any Madsen guns. Not only has the Army Council in London not been up to now in favour of any change, but Ge- neral Headquarters in France have also expressed their opinion that the disad- vantages of adopting at this stage a new type of gun outweigh the advantages. I may add that quite recently the pre- sent Minister of Munitions, who realises to the full the value and merits of the Madsen gun, brought the question of its adoption once again before the military authorities in France. He was himself present at the discussion which followed, and came away very much impressed by the unanimity of the military opinion then expressed. It is quite true, as suggested in Question No. 11, that the present Prime Minister when he was Minister of Munitions did order 5,000 Madsen guns in 1915, and, as the noble and gallant Lord has said, a factory was erected and equipped to carry out this order. There were endless difficulties at that time, but eventually, just before work was about to commence on the production of these Madsen guns in this factory, the War Office intimated to the Ministry of Mu- nitions that they did not require those 5,000, or any of those Madsen guns, which therefore it was obviously no use our making. At that moment the most crying need was for aero-engines, and it was asserted that the whole future of the war depended on the increased supply of aero- engines. In view of this very urgent de- mand and in view of the fact that the War Office did not require the Madsen guns, the Ministry of Munitions decided, as it was very suitable, to divert the factory which had been intended for the manufacture of Madsen guns to the manu- facture of the famous Rolls-Royce engines, and this, I think, has been amply justified by the results obtained. It must be re- membered that when the War Office refused these Madsen guns the supplies of Lewis guns and the increase of the Vickers gun were secure, so that the position was very different, from the War Office point of view, from what it was six months before. Tord Elphinstone. I fully recognise the very evident and legitimate anxiety of the noble Lord as regards this gun. On the other hand, I am quite sure that he is as anxious as any of your Lordships, or as I am, that we should not in any way interfere with or dictate to the military authorities as to what type of gun or shell, or any other munition, they should use, but rather that (he moment they ask us for anything, whatever it may be, we should do our .utmost to supply them with it. As the present Minister of Munitions said recently in the House of Commons, the principal function of his Ministry is to supply stores on the requisition of the Army Council; and in view of the past record of the Ministry—in spite of certain cri- ticisms that have been levelled at some of its procedure—I personally feel confident that, supposing circumstances change and we are asked to provide the Madsen or any other type of gun, somehow or other we vill, as we have always done in the past, find means, however difficult it may be or however impossible it may appear, not to fail our men in the field, but to fulfil their requirements and give them all they want. I think I have now to the best of my ability, though I have not dealt with them s e ria tim, answered all the que- stions which the noble and gallant Lord asked, and I hope I have shown that the non-adoption of the Madsen gun hitherto has not been in any way on account of any doubt as to its value as a gun, but solely on account of what I might call administrative and manufacturing diffi- culties, and because it was feared, for the reasons I have already given, that the introduction of a new type of gun threatened to interfere with the steady flow of the existing type, and this the Army authorities in the field regard as a very grave and serious danger. I am glad however, to be able to say, on behalf of the War Office, that further considera- tion of the whole matter leads us to hope that a way out of the undoubted diffi- culties may yet be found. This is at the moment the subject of very careful consi- deration and investigation by the War Office in close consultation with the Mi- nistry of Munitions, and I think I may say that both Departments are anxious